State multiculturalism: replace it with what?
Posted on Monday 7 February, 2011
Filed Under Conservative Party, Immigration
I’M NOT quite sure whether David Cameron put his own name forward as a founding signatory of Unite Against Fascism, or Unite Against Fascism actively set out to secure his autograph. Either way, many will now be asking which of the two is being more opportunist in maintaining what has always looked suspiciously like a business relationship.
Two days ago, UAF played a leading role in organising a counter-demonstration against an English Defence League march through Luton. More or less simultaneously, the prime minister delivered a speech slamming something called ‘state multiculturalism’. The UAF lot surely won’t have liked that.
Labour justice spokesman Sadiq Khan, one of Labour’s most high profile Muslim politicians, even accused Cameron of ‘writing propaganda’ for the EDL. To accuse any mainstream politician of legitimising an overtly racist organisation – from a peroration delivered in Munich, of all places – is a serious charge.
It’s worth noting that Cameron did not say anything that he has not said before. For instance, he advanced the contention that ‘multiculturalism has failed’ in remarks on the BBC Radio 4 Today Programme in January 2007.
Any suggestion that Cameron is somehow a closet Nazi is clearly ridiculous. Nor would he intentionally appeal to crude low order street thug racial prejudice of the variety espoused by the EDL. Apart from anything else, that sort of thing would lose far more votes than it could conceivably gain.
But ruling these alternatives out, then, what exactly was he on about? What, for instance, is ‘state multiculturalism’ when it is at home? Would multiculturalism somehow be OK if the state butted out and left integration to the forces of laissez faire? Or is opposition to state multiculturalism equivalent to advocacy of state monoculturalism?
The crux of the debate is how far governments should intervene to manipulate the ideologies held by sections of the people who live on the territories they rule, in this case specifically the ideologies of immigrant groups. Is it not self-contradictory for liberalism – in either muscular or weedy guise – to compel others to adopt its tenets?
The caricature is that only lefties want to tell citizens what to think, and while the right favours an absolute free market in ideas. In today’s Britain, it is obviously rather more complicated than that.
‘Engagement’ with Britain’s domestic Islamist extremists has been widely criticised from several standpoints, and I’m not unsympathetic to what has been said. And such a policy, on its own, obviously offers no guarantees against future 7/7s.
Even so, I have one question that hasn’t gone away for the last 48 hours; has Cameron actually got any better ideas?
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67 Responses to “State multiculturalism: replace it with what?”
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Why are posts on this site, which has a certain David Osler with a pretty red star across the name, always reduced to the grunting ignorant monosylables of the very thing some of us come here hoping to escape from? Why?
Got it. Every minute you spend your fine independant minds here with sometimes little better than pond life. Keeps you away from stuff that really matters.
Astro Turfing remember. ‘Jimmy Glesga’ and for all I know ‘David Osler’ is being paid by News International to do it. It fucking works does it not?
Also remember March 26th. Scratch the buggers if you meet them on that day or the weeks after. If it does not bleed. They are not your friend. Though the fucking buggers can still be paid for sleeping with you. Met Police expenses Bill.
Keep safe
Cameron is no racist or Nazi, but his comments are very provincial Tory, no doubt spurred on by too many conversations with folks on the Tory rubber chicken circuit.
“I do not now know any Irish or Asian workers since retirement”
I see. And despite thinking “there must be an answer as to why they come to Great Britain” you never bothered asking your Irish or Asian co-workers what the reason was during all the years you were supposedly their tribune. Now, in retirement, you obviously remain very much at the heart of the working class, since you are constantly telling us about what it thinks and what it is interested in (or rather, what it is not interested in, generally almost everything discussed here). Strangely, though, this working class doesn’t include any Irish or Asian people. And, although your own ancestors were immigrants who came to Scotland because of poverty in their homeland and in order to work hard, you refuse to infer that similar situations and motivations might underlie Irish or Asian immigration, preferring to believe that they are motivated by welfare handouts. I think we are building up a picture of a rather nasty bigot and racist, are we not?
Pharisee, this particular construction was completed quite some time ago.
This is not a work in progress.
‘built’ not ‘building’ for sure…
On a point of information John Rentoul claims in his blog (or to be more precise he quotes Peter Hitchens quoting him) that Tony Blair made almost exactly the same speech about multi-culturalism at least three times as PM – and yet the multi-culty juggernaut just kept rolling on.
The one thing that is different this time is the cuts – not only does Cameron want to rouse up the bigots in his base but this also serves as a perfect justification for saving some more money to give back to his banker friends.
Plus I can see the money that is left getting carefully siphoned into precisely the minority organisations that are most in lign with Tory values – thus creating a new clientele network in which bourgeois ‘community leaders’ will no longer have to pretend to be left-wing in order to access the crumbs of money and power that are still made available to them at the local level.
You just have to hand it to them – the Blairites triangulated themselves into complete impotence and did fuck all for a decade – but the Tories and their Lib-Dem lackeys are not going to leave power without having destroyed everything they can.
pharisee. Some imagination you have. My ancestors were not all immigrants. Just one side of each. The Irish and English married the Scots. But they were all British. So I suppose technically none of them were immigrants. Just mobile British workers. The latter day Norman Tebbits. There was no welfare system in those days. So why do people wish to come to this horrible capitalist Britain? You are clearly a pretend leftie, are we not. Usual crap about racism and bigots. Just because one detests an organisation that is into child molestation, attacks gay people etc etc does not make one a bigot! or a racist. So build your picture, knob.
I spent many years avoiding blogs; I suspected they might be a waste of time, full of inane ‘blatherings’ from frustrated wanabee middle class revolutionaries; or ernest offerings from the newly literate working class (2.1 in politics from Demontfort University) disseminating their essays on Foucault or Gramsci. Imagine my surprise when I tuned into Dave Osler and saw line after line of blatherings from frustrated wanabee middle class revolutionaries and offerings from the newly literate working class.
Get back to your armchairs brothers, the revolution will be televised!!!
JD. You have just joined the inane. You inane silly person. Welcome to the ‘blathering’. Maybe you can take the heat aff me from the pretend middle class socialists.
What exactly *is* a “middle-class socialist” and how do you know, from a blog where most people adopt pseudonyms, who qualifies?
I mean, you must know or otherwise you’re just mindlessly rabbiting on, generalising, ignorantly and stupidly assuming and indulging in reverse snobbery of the most cringe-inducing kind.
I mean, surely not? Not the great proletarian hero ‘Glesga’?
By the way, any chance of getting those “facts on the ground” yet? Rather than some more inane drivel, abuse and your usual utter incoherent pish that pointedly avoids actually answering any questions?
H. I have never known or heard of a proletarian hero. Explain!
“Just because one detests an organisation that is into child molestation, attacks gay people etc etc does not make one a bigot! or a racist”
No, but stating that specifically identified ethnic groups (Irish and Asians in this case) come to Britain in order to sponge off state benefits, in contrast to your own ethnic grouping which works hard and eschews such benefits, is pretty much a textbook embodiment of bigotry and racism (oh sorry, I referred to textbooks there, clearly a sign of being a middle class pretend lefty as Jimmy’s imaginary working class would never have heard of anything as poncey as a textbook).
pharisee. You appear to have an extraordinary imagination. I just pondered why people wish to come to this deplorable capitalist country that you lefties detest and wish to overthrow. Then you go on a useless leftie rant.
“pharisee. You appear to have an extraordinary imagination. I just pondered why people wish to come to this deplorable capitalist country that you lefties detest and wish to overthrow. Then you go on a useless leftie rant.”
Er, you aimed your remarks at Pharisee (finishing off by calling him a ‘knob’ incidentally)
So he then posted…
“No, but stating that specifically identified ethnic groups (Irish and Asians in this case) come to Britain in order to sponge off state benefits, in contrast to your own ethnic grouping which works hard and eschews such benefits, is pretty much a textbook embodiment of bigotry and racism (oh sorry, I referred to textbooks there, clearly a sign of being a middle class pretend lefty as Jimmy’s imaginary working class would never have heard of anything as poncey as a textbook).”
To normal people, this is known as a ‘response’. It’s a commonly used tactic during discourse, exchanges, debates and even normal conversation.
Sadly, for you, I’m afraid, it appears any such responses or even the mildest disagreement to what clearly is racism and bigotry, not to mention astonishing ignorance, stupidity and arrogance, is a ‘leftie rant’.
Only in the warped, dysfunctional place known as ‘Glesga’ world…
H. You seem to be the spokesman sorry person for pharisee. I am sure he/she is capable.
H. I have never said anything that is intended to be racist or bigoted. And pharisee has still not taken the opperchansity to explain in his/her words why he/she thinks people come to this terrible capitalist country, Britain.
OK, as his/her spokesman, I’ll answer: presumably for the same reason record numbers of Brits left last year to live in Spain, Australia, Canada and Portugal.
And for the same reason millions of people around the globe emigrate every day.
So your point was…?
H. My point! The fuckin weather for the oldies. Getting a heating allowance to give presents to the grandweans (as my sister does). And I wish those that emigrate a good peaceful life as my ancestors gave me. H. You are like a Bairn hingin oot a pram asking questions! I do not know how to do the smiley yellow faces! Can you help?